Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2002 To: "St. Bede's List" From: "Tony Hitsman" Subject: dumb food questions for UK listsibs I'm going overseas for the first time, and have some food questions for our UK listsibs: - do they have MacDonald's in the UK (asking just out of curiousity here) - what are some of the other fast food places over there? - are fish and chips still popular in the UK as they once were? - what kind of food do the pubs serve? - what constitutes an average breakfast in the UK? What little I know of the UK comes from reading English books - mostly out of date; and the telly (BBC World News). Also - someone onlist may have some advice regarding money - is it better to exchange Canadian dollars for pounds sterling before leaving here or after arriving in the UK? Does it really make a difference? Not leaving until April, but these questions have all been nagging me recently. Boom Boom ------------------------------ From: PBerry7053 Hi Tony, We have MacDonalds. (I can think of nothing more to say!) Loads of em. And Burger Kings. And KFC. We are simply an outpost of the US culinary empire. > - are fish and chips still popular in the UK as they once were? No, but they're still around. Most have switched to vegetable 'fats' for cooking with. Low cholestrol, much healthier. But don't taste as nice. They've been somewhat displaced by Indian restaurants/takeaways (ask for the nearest 'curry house' or 'balti place') Chinese & Italian places are very common, Thai seems to be coming in and Tex/Mex. Pizza parlours and Kebab places very common. (I speak for small town UK - huge metrolopses will have the full monty of course from various species of Chinese thru Greek .. everything.) > - what kind of food do the pubs serve? Pubs generally are the cheapest places to sit down and eat, though the UK is an expensive place to eat out and prices vary regionally and by location. You can get a hot meal for UKP5 with beer at UKP1.80 - 2.20 a pint. Some pubs specialise in food but in my experience can change quicky from being top class to yuk - hard to keep a good chef, I think. Best ask the locals are pretend you've just gone in for a beer and look for signs of food poisoning. > - what constitutes an average breakfast in the UK? Coffee. > Also - someone onlist may have some advice regarding money - Can't help there Tony. I'm not trusted with money. > Not leaving until April, but these questions have all been nagging me recently. Obviously a man with the right priorities, if I may say so. (If you talk to Sally nicely she may make you some sandwiches up - with marmite.) God bless, Take care Pete ------------------------------ From: Elizabeth Kipp Can help with the fish and chips. Outside of the Tower of London is a fish and chips wagon which had the most marvellous fish and chips. The only thing missing was the newspaper as my grandparents told of fish and chips wrapped in newspaper. The average breakfast in the UK is fabulous. Eggs, rashers, cooked vegetable - tomatoes, sausage, toast, marmalade, juice. ------------------------------ From: Scott Knitter I know I'm not a UK listsib, but I must say they do have Starbucks coffee in the UK (Edinburgh and London, at least), Pizza Hut, McDonald's, KFC, Burger King, and probably many others. And I generally use my credit card as much as possible, and the automated teller machines, beginning with the one in the airport, to get pounds sterling. I don't exchange anything before leaving this side of the pond. ===== Scott Knitter - East Lansing, Michigan USA ------------------------------ From: "Charles Wohlers" > I'm going overseas for the first time, and have some food questions > Also - someone onlist may have some advice regarding money All this is very interesting to me also, as I & family will be visiting Britain & Ireland this summer - early June -> early July. Advice I've had on money is to simply take an ATM card. They have lots of them over there, and they will work with your card. One little thing for US (& Canadian?) bank customers, tho: your password *must* be no more than four characters. Oh, and my kids will be *very* happy to learn that there are McDonalds in Britain. Chad Wohlers East Bridgewater, Mass. USA ------------------------------ From: Roland Orr Some Answers below Roland >- do they have MacDonald's in the UK (asking just out of curiousity here) Too Many >- what are some of the other fast food places over there? Try Burger King >- are fish and chips still popular in the UK as they once were? YES although there is a shortage of North Sea Fish My wife and I buy and bring home to eat Some Fish and Chip shops have an eating area. If there is a queue it means that the fish is good. I personally prefer Cod and Chips - others may have their own views >- what kind of food do the pubs serve? Anything from sandwiches to a very good up market meal in the pub resaurant >- what constitutes an average breakfast in the UK? I normally have shredded wheat or museli at home However there is a chain or roadside restaurants called "Little Chef" Their Fruit Juice, Bacon & Eggs +++ , toast & marmalade, tea/coffee + a paper to read is very good value >What little I know of the UK comes from reading English books and the telly. TV more reliable >Also - someone onlist may have some advice regarding money You can sell your C4 in most high street banks/travel agents. Probably makes little difference unless you buy in Canada with a no commission deal when you sell back. Most people use their Visa or card, & not much cash Hope this helps BUT others from USA/Can who have been to UK recently may have other views -------------------------------------- From: "Tracy Baxter" - do they have MacDonald's in the UK (asking just out of curiousity here) [Tracy ] Saw at least one in London while I was over - so yes they have Mickey D's there. - what are some of the other fast food places over there? - are fish and chips still popular in the UK as they once were? [Tracy ] Fairly popular from what I saw. - what kind of food do the pubs serve? [Tracy ] Normal fair, and of course fish and chips (!) - what constitutes an average breakfast in the UK? [Tracy ] Same breakfasts as here more or less - watch out for Marmite - some people LOVE it but I find it very salty (wants a glass of water just thinking of it) What little I know of the UK comes from reading English books - mostly out of date; and the telly (BBC World News). [Tracy ] In my whirlwind tour I saw a LOT and just scrapped the surface. Tops on my list Tower of London, Windsor Castle, Town of Rye (old medieval town - cobble stone streets etc.) Stonehenge is everything you'd imagine it to be, but I got more eerie sense of awe at Avebury, where the stones form two huge rings - in the middle of farmers fields - you can tour and actually touch the stones - something you can't do at Stonehenge. There are also great figures made of I know not what, in fields one is a horse. Canterbury Cathedral - I spent the whole day there and could have spent another day or so there and still wanted more, the history in that one building is amazing. I highly recommend the guided tour, a check out the gift shop for great postcards, but if you don't find the pictures of the things you want you can buy a photo pass and go take pictures for yourself. The photo pass is a common practice in a lot of the historic places - don't take photos without checking first - it doesn't cost much for the pass. St. Paul's cathedral, Westminster Abbey, Salisbury Cathedral and a number of other churches well worth seeing, all but Salisbury Cathedral I went to a service of sorts (2 evensongs (Canterbury and Westminster) and a Mass - St. Paul's) Stratford is great for the history, but I found the theatre and the had the sense that Shakespeare is more alive in Stratford Ontario - a town that revolves around it's theatres, where Stratford England is just there - and Shakespeare was once there too. The Globe Theatre in London is a real treat - pay to sit, or stand in the yard for either a penny or very little I believe. Great fun! Of course my visit had something yours won't because it is too late to arrange it - Tea at Buckhouse (ok with 4000 other people) but a very cool experience all the same. Also - someone onlist may have some advice regarding money - is it better to exchange Canadian dollars for pounds sterling before leaving here or after arriving in the UK? Does it really make a difference? [Tracy ] Doesn't make a difference, I went over with some and then my bankcard And if you are the person that was going to buy Harry Potter over there - don't Canadians have the same version here. It would be like buying Paddington Bear at Paddington Stn. Exactly the same bear you find over here - none that have a tag saying "Please take care of this bear" (which is what I wanted) and very expensive. Buy one here and make believe you found it there. Just don't insult the natives by calling their gardens "backyards" ;) -TB ------------------------------ From: "Tony Hitsman" > I personally prefer Cod and Chips - others may have their own views I eat cod almost every day here, so I feel right at home. Almost never eat chips; rather I have cold corn from the can at the side. > I normally have shredded wheat or museli at home . . . . a > paper to read is very good value Again, mostly what I have here, except for the newspaper (I go online at breakfast to get the CBC Overnight and the New York Times every day) > You can sell your C4 in most high street banks/travel agents. C4 is what? Thanks, Roland! ------------------------------ From: "sally.mullock" LOL at some of the responses you have received so far Tony!! Yes, you fall of McD's everywhere here. > - what are some of the other fast food places over there? There are numerous ones as has already been mentioned. We here have Pizza Express and Starbucks and various Chineese, Greek, Indian, Bangladeshi etc take aways and resturants > - are fish and chips still popular in the UK as they once were? We do have a very good chip shop, though as Elizabeth (Hi!) noted, we don't serve them in newspaper any more. I'm not that keen myself. > - what kind of food do the pubs serve? Varies greatly depending on whether the pub is part of a chain or not. Here in Wilmslow we have numerous Cafe/Bars which are the current rage. > - what constitutes an average breakfast in the UK? Well I fell about at Pete's reply as it is pretty accurate for the B&B you will be staying in (ie here!) but I do throw in toast, cereal or porridge if required. > What little I know of the UK comes from reading English > books - mostly out of date; and the telly (BBC World News). Brace yourself for a sharp learning curve > Also - someone onlist may have some advice regarding money We are awash with ATM's (or as we call them cash machines) which will take your cards. But if you change currency at the airport or PO you don't get charged. > Not leaving until April, but these questions have all been nagging me recently. Feel free to ask whatever is bothering you. How about the weather???? Love SallyM ------------------------------ From: "Carol M. Marsh" > - are fish and chips still popular in the UK as they once were? The best fish and chips come off wagons and are wrapped in newspaper or brown paper. Elizabeth Kipp (hi, Elizabeth) wrote: > The average breakfast in the UK is fabulous. Eggs, rashers, cooked > vegetable - tomatoes, sausage, toast, marmalade, juice. And blood pudding. Sounds horrid, but it really is tasty, IMO. In Northumbria, you're close enough to Scotland that you may find some decent haggis. That's another food that often gets a bad rap, but it can be really yummy, so take your chances and make up your own mind. Forget the Mickey D's and other U.S. franchises, Tony. The best eats are in the pubs where the locals go. Be sure to try a ploughman's lunch and toad-in-the-whole. When you go over into Wales where Sally's relatives are, try some of their sausages. Over in the Lake District where the tourists hang out, there's several places I recall fondly where the curries are to die for. That may be off your path though. The Lake District is a bit far from Sally's stomping grounds, I think. Carol, who travels the world on her stomach and has the figure to prove it. ------------------------------ From: Roger Stokes >- do they have MacDonald's in the UK asking just out of curiousity here) Tony, I thought you were asking _food_ questions :-) >- what are some of the other fast food places over there? KFC, various burger places, wait a few minutes for Chinese, Italian, Indian. Wimpey's is now Burger King IIRC >- are fish and chips still popular in the UK as they once were? Still around, even if they are outnumbered by other cuisines now. They're not allowed to wrap them in newspaper now because of hygiene regulations :-( >- what kind of food do the pubs serve? What do you want? It varies according to the pub. Many will do variety of pies, burgers, chicken, fish, scampi, steak, etc. I know of one which does Thai. >- what constitutes an average breakfast in the UK? That's a hard one. The full English (other parts of the UK have slight variants) breakfast can consist of cereal (cornflakes, etc), juice, sausage, bacon, tomatoes, egg and perhaps some extra bits & pieces, toast & marmalade or jam, coffee or tea. Most people probably have something simpler at home - cereal, toast & coffee. >Also - someone onlist may have some advice regarding money Depends on the commission and spread (difference between buying and selling) that they charge. UK High Street banks can be quite competitive, while Visa or Mastercard can be better for many purchases depending how much your card company charges for foreign purchases. As Scott says, an ATM will get you cash - once you have waited for it to make the connection with your bank to check you have the funds. Chad, however, should beware because they are not always that common in Ireland once you move outside the major cities, in fact finding an open bank can be a problem as well. Peace, Roger, Bedford, UK ------------------------------ From: Rod/Hazel Peterson Charles Wohlers wrote: Oh, and my kids will be *very* happy to learn that there are McDonalds in Britain. Ten years ago one of my daughters came with me to England. She was dreadfully disappointed when we went to by brother's home. He had promised to take us out to a pie and liquor shop. (I have no idea how that word is *really* written but I think it means sauce, or gravy!). Sis-in-law decided that we should do something far more exciting - go to McDonalds drive-through and eat in the car. Rachel didn't like McDonalds in Canada, despised eating in the car and rather fancied pie. We were surprised to discover that KFC tasted different over there, and take-out didn't include napkins (a minor detail we discovered after carrying our food up Beacon Hill in Gravesend) Rachel found a friendly spaniel who was delighted to lick off the grease off her fingers. We found some fish and chips that smelled and tasted just like I remembered. Also enjoyed pease pudding and savaloys. I'd recommend staying away from the fast food junk meals and trying some of the *real* food - steak and kidney pie (or pudding), scones and clotted cream, tripe, Melton Mowbray pie (pork pie), Oxtail soup, Lancashire Hotpot and don't forget to check out the bakeries for Creamhorns, Banbury cakes, Chelsea buns and various other mouth watering delights. Enjoy Hazel - who is heading into the kitchen to bake up some parkin. ------------------------------ From: "Tony Hitsman" Hazel writ large: > We found some fish and chips . . . . pease pudding and savaloys . . . . > Lancashire Hotpot . . . . Creamhorns, . . . . Banbury cakes . . . . Okay... could you explain these terms you use: savaloys Lancashire Hotpot Creamhorns Banbury cakes Thanks to all for their many replies to this thread! Tony, looking forward to epicurean delights in the UK ------------------------------ From: "Tony Hitsman" > We here have Pizza Express and Starbucks and various Chineese, Greek, > Indian, Bangladeshi etc take aways and resturants Just had a vision of ERII ordering a pizza. Pizza in the UK!!! egads. Tony ------------------------------ From: Roland Orr Yes Pizza + Lasagna etc very popular for the last 30 years and Italian Restaurants and Italian fast food is very popular as is French, Chinese, Thai and so on. It is often difficult to find an English food only restaurant except for pubs and fish and chips etc. Lots of brits go to Italy (Europe) on vacation each year eg PM Tony HM can ring up for a Pizza express motor bike service or get somebody to get one out of a freezer or get one of her Chefs to make one Roland -------------------------------------- From: Roger Stokes >Just had a vision of ERII ordering a pizza. Tony, She may well, but I expect it will be better quality from her own kitchens than from Domino :-) >Pizza in the UK!!! When Joan was in hospital it felt like we were back in Rome. Italian was the normal language spoken in her bay as two of the other three beds were occupied by Italians and the third bed was sometimes empty or otherwise occupied by a lady who did not speak much. The Italians had plenty of visitors, and most of the domestic staff are Italian as well. Peace, Roger ------------------------------ From: "Tony Hitsman" > Yes Pizza + Lasagna etc very popular for the last 30 years I guess that raises the questions, what, exactly, is _English_ food? Hazel Peterson earlier today made an interesting list, below: > pease pudding and savaloys . . Lancashire Hotpot . . Creamhorns. . Banbury cakes Tony, who'd still like to know what all that stuff (above) actually is, although I've had steak and kidney pie and scones. ------------------------------ From: klewis Elizabeth wrote: > The average breakfast in the UK is fabulous. Eggs, rashers, cooked > vegetable - tomatoes, sausage, toast, marmalade, juice. Ok, my dumb question for the day: What is/are rashers? Peace, Kris ------------------------------ From: mjanderson > Ok, my dumb question for the day: What is/are rashers? In my part of the U.S., on fancier restaurant menus, they are thick strips of bacon. Mary Jane ------------------------------ From: Hazel Peterson Tony Hitsman wrote: Okay... could you explain these terms you use: > savaloys > Lancashire Hotpot > Creamhorns > Banbury cakes Saveloys - a dryish type of pork sausage - the ones we had were boiled Lancashire Hotpot - a distinctive stew-like dish made with lamb, cooked in a casserole with slices of potato baked on top. Creamhorns - fancy pastry in the shape of a cone. The best types have REAL cream and a bit of jam inside. The more common variety have cream-like product and artificial jam! Banbury cakes - another sweet goodie. A round of flaky, crumby pastry with dried fruits inside. Too bad you don't live closer or I'd give you a chunk of the parkin I made earlier. Hazel ------------------------------ From: klewis > Too bad you don't live closer or I'd give you a chunk of the parkin I made And that would be.....? Peace, Kris ------------------------------ From: "Charles T. Smith, Jr." >> > - are fish and chips still popular in the UK as they once were? >The best fish and chips come off wagons and are wrapped in newspaper or brown paper. The best of the best fish and chips come of wagons and are wrapped in yesterday's Tory^H^H^H^HTelegraph :) ------------------------------ From: "Charles T. Smith, Jr." > >- are fish and chips still popular in the UK as they once were? > Still around, even if they are outnumbered by other cuisines now. They're > not allowed to wrap them in newspaper now because of hygiene regulations :-( :( Do you folks on that side of th' pond have no bloody respect for tradition? What next? Are the guards at Buckingham palace going to start posing and chatting up the tourists? :) ------------------------------ From: "Carol M. Marsh" Rod/Hazel Peterson wrote: > Too bad you don't live closer or I'd give you a chunk of the parkin I made OK, Hazel, so what's parkin? Carol ----------------------------- From: "Ian Gomersall" Hello, What I have yet to see in the UK is 'Bettys' - Have I got the name right? I ts the traditional burger chain found in the States (and in Continental Europe). What we also do not have is much variety in take away snacks available after 6pm - certainly not in smaller towns. Cafes, and snack bars, except in cities, tend to close by 5 or 6pm. "The average breakfast in the UK is fabulous" - I'm not sure what average refers to here! I suspect 'Bed and Breakfast accommodation'. I don't think the 'average' British home has larged cooked breakfasts each day. Fr Ian. ------------------------------ From: Roger Stokes Rod/Hazel Peterson wrote, and Tony wanted explanation: >Also enjoyed pease pudding Pease is the ancient spelling of peas and the pudding is made from this split peas, soaked for hours then cooked long and slow then rendered into a homogenous consistency by pushing through a sieve. Reminds me too much of school dinners :-) If Sally takes you into Yorkshre you may come across mushy peas which are marrowfat peas, again soaked and cooked for a long time until they are, as the name suggests, mushy. >and savaloys. Don't know about that one unless they're similar to what are called faggots in some parts, which are pix's liver, onion and pork simmered then minced, formed into balls with egg and breadcrumbs and baked. >steak and kidney pie (or pudding), would you believe they're made with steak and kidney? Braising steak and beef kidney. When I was young kidney was more expensive than the steak but that position has now been reversed so you may more than the standard 25% kidney. Cooked in gravy, usually in a small dish in pubs, with a puff pastry lid on top. At home the lid may be shortcrust pastry, or it may be done in a basin with suet pastry surrounding the meat - very satisfying but not generally seen when eating out :-( >scones and clotted cream, Scones or soft cakes of individual size, available plain, with fruit or cheese, and some other varieties as well. In Devon in particular they are fruit scones, split in two, buttered and then piled with strawberry jam and clotted cream. This is cream that has been heated until it starts to thicken rather than just whipped from cold. >tripe, Cow stomach - you did ask! Regarded as a delicacy by some in the North. > Melton Mowbray pie ( pork pie), Minced or (small) diced pork baked in a pie. The contents of the pie also contain a stock made from simmering the bones and off-cuts of the pork for a couple of hours so that it sets when cold. >Oxtail soup, Soup made from an ox (or probably cow) tail, half of which has been fried to give it a dark brown colour. >Lancashire Hotpot A stew of meat and vegetables. Anything and everything can go into it but normally potatoes and carrots as a minimum. You may sometimes encounter it with cobblers, which are bits of suet pastry that have been cooked in the stew. >Creamhorns, Puff pastry horns stuffed with cream - not to be tried if you want to eat delicately and cleanly :-) >Banbury cakes, A spiced cake made at Banbury, Oxfordshire - not tried that one. Many areas of the country have their local or regional specialty foods. Ours is the Bedfordshire Clanger, a variant on the traditional Cornish Pasty with savoury at one end and sweet at the other. >Chelsea buns Made from a yeast dough, to which is then added dried fruit and candied peel. Rolled up like a swiss roll, then sliced, placed on the flat sides so formed and baked. >parkin. Ginger cake - another Yorkshire specialty. Kris asked about rashers - those are slices of bacon which are fried or grilled. If cooking a turkey they are often placed across the breast of the bird to keep it moist. Be thankful your air-fare back does not depend on your weight ;-) Peace, Roger, Bedford, UK ------------------------------ From: Roger Stokes At 10:10 PM 09/03/02 -0400, Charles T. Smith, Jr. wrote: >Do you folks on that side of th' pond have no bloody respect for tradition? Charles, It's all due to our continental ene, colleagues, across the Channel. The European Union issues directives on hygiene - and then the UK is the only country that enforces them. >What next? Are the guards at Buckingham palace going >to start posing and chatting up the tourists? They don't chat up the tourists but the Horse Guards do pose prettily for pictures, and the Yeoman Warders (Beefeaters) at the Tower of London are generally very cooperative. Peace, Roger, ------------------------------ From: "Tony Hitsman" > Be thankful your air-fare back does not depend on your weight ;-) Thanks again to all who responded to my initial question on this thread, and for the coffee spinoff thread. Roger's comment (above) reminds me that I'll have to watch my weight. Probably will skip breakfast or lunch if having a heavy meal the evening before, something I already practice here. What I've seen posted about English cooking sounds very traditional Brit. My grandma was Scotch (Munro) and dad's descendants were Hugenouts that settled in Nova Scotia and worked their way westward to Eastern Ontario after getting booted out of Papist France. Cooking in our home growing up in the 50's was always roast beef on Sundays and leftovers for the next day or two, then steak or steak and kidney pie on occasion for Granny when she visited. A lot of bread and potatoes during the week. Thankfully, mum's cooking evolved a bit, more fish added to the menu, spaghetti on Saturdays. We had started a garden by that time so always had fresh tomatoes, carrots, green and yellow beans, corn, squash, and pumpkin and we added a garden to every home we moved into during our many moves (mum became one of those who brought up old homes and renovated them and sold for a profit, and we also built four homes in the Ottawa area). Course mum was busy with Statistics Canada by that time and curling on the weekends (as was I) so fast food started to make an entrance into our lives. We started to have steaks and chops for the first time and roast beef maybe once a month. And more spaghetti and once in a while those dreadful frozen fish fillets and frozen chips, both heated in the oven. We had egg and bacon breakfasts once in a while, but most of the time it was cereal or toast and marmalade and tea. We started with coffee around 1961. After I went off to college in 1968, and dad died soon after, we had all gone our separate ways and cooking for ourselves. I'm still here in reasonably good health so I've done something right. Cut out much of the beef and pork. More cod, no shellfish. And limited myself to one or two coffees in the morning only. Now, off to Chevery and back to Harrington for services today. Tony ------------------------------ From: BANFUR3 roger.stokes writes: << sausage, bacon, tomatoes, egg and perhaps some extra bits & pieces, toast Good Morning Roger and All: My Mum, who was from England, used to fry tomatoes, red not green. Is that how they are cooked for breakfast? If not, how are they fixed and are they the stewed type. Thanks for the info. Peace - Love Eileen ------------------------------ From: "Carol M. Marsh" Roger Stokes wrote: > Pease is the ancient spelling of peas and the pudding is made from this > split peas, soaked for hours then cooked long and slow then rendered into a > homogenous consistency by pushing through a sieve. Surely you remember the nursery rhyme: Pease porridge hot, Pease porridge cold, Pease porridge in the pot -- Nine days old. I learned that as a wee tyke when the only thing that resembled protein in our house was some kind of beans or other legume. I suspect its origin was among folks who were lucky to have anything at all to eat. Carol, old enough to remember depression & WWII food -- Carol Marsh ------------------------------ From: "Carol M. Marsh" Roger (Hi, Roger) mentioned cobblers and described them as having a suet dough cooked in the gravy or sauce. Here cobblers are a popular dessert, commonly apple, blackberry, peach or cherry cooked with sugar to make a whole or sliced fruit sauce with a baking power pastry overlaid on top and baked. I've had cobbler occasionally in other parts of the U.S., but here in the southwest they're the most common dessert on any menu. Carol ------------------------------ From: Rod/Hazel Peterson Roger Stokes wrote: regarding savaloys - > Don't know about that one unless they're similar to what are called faggots > in some parts, which are pix's liver, onion and pork simmered then minced, > formed into balls with egg and breadcrumbs and baked. I'm getting homesick for all these goodies! Forgot about the faggots my Uncle Charlie used to bring home sometimes on payday - with pease pudding. Does anyone have access to an actual recipe - I'm sure I can get the necessary ingredients. Never did like tripe - or jellied eels either, but the fresh shellfish were much enjoyed, (cockles, mussels, whelks, winkles and so on). All the other items I make already - plus brawn, Cornish pasties, potato cakes, Eccles cakes and sausage rolls. Ooops nearly told a lie - I don't make clotted cream though a friend knows where to buy it in cans. Can Brits still buy my all time favourite fish - herrings (we ate them often when I was a kid because they were cheap and tasty). We used to be able to get them here, frozen of course, but still delicious. Haven't seen any in the stores for 15 years or so. We eat roe from the lake fish we catch ourselves. Hazel ------------------------------ From: Elizabeth Kipp Grew up on a lot of "british" food until I was 20 when I married, my husband's background was US and then early canadian (and before that european, it is interesting being married to someone who's family has been in the US (before coming here in 1800) since the 1630s. I haven't had a steak and kidney pie since I was married (36 years ago), love tripe but haven't had that either. However, I make cornish pasties as they are great in children's lunches - at least mine liked them (as did my husband). Trifle is a real favourite and I make it with sherry. My mother in law always found life difficult with us as I cook a lot with wine or liqueur. Since it is always cooked in things I never thought about it very much as it disappears but leaves that wonderful flavour. I think learning that I put it into stew and had for all those years was an enormous surprise as she greatly enjoyed the stew remarking on the flavour. I always said it was the cast iron pot as I really didn't want to give up wine in our stew. It is very fortifying with wine in it. She lived to be 95 and was diabetic which is quite remarkable. My husband once told her it was the wine that I put in the cooking that contributed to her longevity. I do not think that British people use wine much in their cooking - do they?? On Sun, 10 Mar 2002, Rod/Hazel Peterson wrote: > Never did like tripe - or jellied eels either, but the fresh shellfish were much > enjoyed, (cockles, mussels, whelks, winkles and so on). All the other items I make > already - plus brawn, Cornish pasties, potato cakes, Eccles cakes and sausage > rolls. Ooops nearly told a lie - I don't make clotted cream though a friend knows > where to buy it in cans. Elizabeth (Blake) Kipp ------------------------------ From: "Tony Hitsman" > Can Brits still buy my all time favourite fish - herrings We get herring here fresh from the water - tons and tons of it. Use it mostly for bait for crab. I love pickled herring, but the folks here think I'm from another planet when I have it. Almost any shellfish you can mention is found here. Tony, on the coast of the Gulf of St. Lawrence, back from skidooing in the rain to Chevery and back, now completely soaked and tired and off to bed! ------------------------------ From: Richard Konopka From: "Carol M. Marsh" > Surely you remember the nursery rhyme: > > Pease porridge hot, > Pease porridge cold, > Pease porridge in the pot -- > Nine days old. Continuing (obAng) Some like it hot, Some like it cold, Some like it in the pot-- Nine days old An apt rhyme for our beloved Communion From St. Luke's Montclair, New Jersey where today we had Rite I Holy Eucharist with Rite II service music, a Gather psalm melody, a Gibbons anthem, a Sursum Corda and Canon preface chanted in Russian tones wobbling off into Mozarabic weirdness (because the rector finds this more satisfying than Ambrosian ), LEVAS II communion (bass part = two note range) but saved by glorious stalwarts Let There Be Light (moscow) and O For a Thousand Tongues to Sing, a Wesley gem. Sermon by Sandra Swan, Exec. Dir.,Episcopal Relief and Development --marvelous preacher. Richard ------------------------------ From: Roger Stokes At 10:03 AM 10/03/02 -0600, Rod/Hazel Peterson wrote: >Forgot about the faggots my Uncle Charlie used to bring home sometimes on payday > - with pease pudding. Does anyone have access to an actual recipe - I'm sure > I can get the necessary ingredients. Answers to a few others a re appended below to keep my post-count down but here are the recipes. SEE RECIPE: Faggots SEE RECIPE: Pease Pudding Eileen, the tomatoes can either be halved and fried like her mother did or now in some places you will get heated canned (plum) tomatoes which keep better on a hotel servery. Elizabeth, wine is not used much in traditional English cooking as it is not a national drink, and the excise duty is too high. It is coming in a bit now, but beer (often referred to as ale in this context) is sometimes used in things like steak pies. First remove the cook from the bottle :-) Peace, Roger, ------------------------------ From: "Elizabeth Kipp" Love that Roger - first remove the cook from the bottle. Never cooked with beer but do remember that it went into things like steak and kidney pie (to tenderize the kidney I think I heard it said!!). No I can never remember any dishes with wine - whiskey yes but not wine. Whiskey gives good flavour to a fruit cake. Elizabeth (Blake) Kipp ------------------------------ From: "Tony Hitsman" Roger writ large: > Answers to a few others a re appended below to keep my post-count down Oops! Is _this_ the List where we're supposed to keep our posts down? I thought it was the _other_ one! Tony, who probably should lurk for the rest of this month ------------------------------ From: "B. D. Colt" On 9 Mar 02, at 8:38, PBerry7053 > (I speak for small town UK - huge metrolopses will have the full monty > of course from various species of Chinese thru Greek .. everything.) Is "Chinese through Greek" the best they can do? How about "Albanian through Zimbabwean"? Barbara D. Colt, St John the Evangelist, San Francisco ------------------------------ From: Rod/Hazel Peterson I mentioned that I made a batch of parkin and caused Kris to ask "What is parkin?" SEE RECIPE: Parkin Hazel ------------------------------ From: Scott Knitter North Americans who don't want to substitute ingredients can find them at http://www.goodwoods.com or http://www.bbcamerica.com - Cost Plus World Market also has some UK products like golden syrup and maybe even black treacle. ===== Scott Knitter - East Lansing, Michigan USA ------------------------------ From: "Phil and Jean Gandon" Hazel - I couldn't wait! I checked and found we had all the needed ingredients, so I cooked up a batch of Parkin. Just tasted the first piece - mmm mmm good Mind you, I think 1 - 11/4 hours a bit long. I stuck a needle in at 50 minutes and it came out clean so I figured it was done. Phil+ ------------------------------ From: Richard Konopka All this talk of English food reminds me how much I love things cooked with suet or lard ;-( Oh well, everything is worse for vegetable oil except my heart. I know-- I've seen it on monitor in the OR being snaked about by a wire or scope and I am clean as a whistle. Cholestrol = 153. Genetics, not diet! This thread also reminds me that at coffee hour today I was asked to feed a group of eight Bedfordshire singers on Tues. April 3, part a larger choral group, the Amici Singers. It's their third tour of the States and they always start out at Saint Lukes. We board them for three nights (about 40) feed them and get them to and from their group bus each day. As I can't provide lodging, I was asked to provide a simple dinner party, one of five to be held simultaneously. All of these foods posts and recipes are making me hungry. There has been nothing mentioned here that I don't enjoy. I make tripe very well in five styles: au mode du Caen, stewed Jamaican style with peppercorns, Mondongo con patos de vaca or Dominican Tripe stew with cow's feet and lastly, Italian in sauce, and creamed tripe with baby onions --my mother's putatively 'Irish' style and my least favorite. I like haggis and all the greasy snacks, Mobray pies, Cornish pasties. We get excellent pasties from Mine Hill and Wharton -- old mining towns in the next county over settled by Cornish miners.I love haggis and eel and just about everything except treacle and some of the really sweet confections. We can buy scones, cakes, biscuits, clotted cream and English jams at my neighborhood supermarket, Kings, which is wholly owned by Marks & Spencer and supplied (as to American foods) by my employer, White Rose. I have been wondering what to serve at the hot and cold buffet I intend to do. I wonder if I should slip in a few obscure English items mentioned here amid the roast beef, ham, salads and pickles/relishes? Maybe they'd not measure up to someone's granny's recipe and I would have wasted the effort. Maybe the ladies of Amici are all svelt and calorie conscious. Or just maybe they'd think, "What an idiot! If I'd wanted to eat a pork pie I would have stayed at home." So, having 95% comitted to the St. Lukes liaison, I am officially beginning to agonize over what to serve. She, liaison lady said "Oh it needn't be fancy, just some sandwiches and salads on paper plates. Don't worry!" I had to tell her that Albert wouldn't consider using anything but the pre-war Staffordshire and silver and it would become anything but simple!" So spare a prayer I do this wisely and too well. Yes, you heard right. Richard ------------------------------ From: Scott Knitter Our university choir director was fond of describing typical tour-stop food as "three beans, a wiener, and tepid Kool-Aid." :) Which sounds like the liaison's expectation. Anyone dining chez Richard et Albert will enjoy something several levels better, of course! Scott Knitter - East Lansing, Michigan USA ------------------------------ From: Roger Stokes At 03:03 PM 10/03/02 -0500, Richard Konopka wrote: >We can buy scones, cakes, biscuits, clotted cream and English jams . . . . Seeing that the singers are from Bedfordshire how about a variant on the Bedfordshire Clanger, which they probably haven't tried? Recipes are available at http://www.kal69.dial.pipex.com/874meat.htm and http://www.bedfordshire.gov.uk/noframes/SDclanger.nsf/9046f9677fc1aab380256a410041f416/fd19584997775b7d80256a41002c5589?OpenDocument A little musical accompaniment by the same name can be found at http://homepage.ntlworld.com/cliff.uney/Tunes.htm Peace, Roger, Bedford, UK ------------------------------ From: Cantor03 Richard K mentions lard- My mother, dead three years ago at 97, always used lard as the basis for her piecrusts, and they were incomparable: light, flakey, delicious, and probably loaded with cholesterol. I don't care. Anytime mom's apple pie appeared in front of me I ate it. David Strang. ------------------------------ From: Elizabeth Kipp I always use lard but do not make them a lot and never during Lent. Perhaps it was my mother's custom to have everything plain during Lent - no icing, no rich food. -- Elizabeth (Blake) Kipp ------------------------------ From: "Raewynne J. Whiteley" I use lard for piecrusts because I can't eat dairy - seems to work fine. Raewynne ------------------------------ From: fr tony Lard ? My Yorkshire grandmother kept a jar on the stove filled with beef drippings. We Northerners called it "mucky fat". It was wonderful just spread on a piece of bread. Most unhealthy of course! Used in making Yorkshire Pudding it did the trick. Warmly, Tony The Rev. Anthony Clavier Diocese of South Dakota Trinity Episcopal Church, Watertown, SD ------------------------------ From: BANFUR3@ << I've had steak and kidney pie and scones. >> Good Afternoon Friends: My Mum used to make steak pies for us at home without the kidneys because we would not eat them. As a young adult with small children I carried on with the steak pies and will have to think about making a small one for myself. They taste great and all this talk is making me hungry for one. Peace - Love Eileen ------------------------------ From: PBerry7053 In a message dated 11/03/02 01:24:42 GMT Standard Time, babc2@attbi.com writes: > Is "Chinese through Greek" the best they can do? > How about "Albanian through Zimbabwean"? I wouldn't have thought Albania is as far from Zimbabwe as China is from Greece - or am I missing something? 8<) Pete ------------------------------ From: Sibyl Smirl > I wouldn't have thought Albania is as far from Zimbabwe as > China is from Greece - or am I missing something? 8<) Depends on which way 'round you go, geographically, but alphabetically, Albania is about as far from Zimbabwe as it's possible to get. ------------------------------ From: "gardener" Question! I'm picking Roger Stokes' post at random, because it pretty well exemplifies my concern: savaloys-- "Don't know about that one unless they're similar to what are called faggots in some parts, which are pix's liver, onion and pork simmered then minced, formed into balls with egg and breadcrumbs and baked." and " steak and kidney. . . cooked in gravy. . . suet pastry surrounding the meat " and. . tripe, minced diced pork in a pie, oxtails . . . How do vegetarians travel in England? Are they barely tolerated, in this meat-loving culture? Do vegetarian travelers end up living on muesli and being very abashed dinner guests because they can't eat most of the food? --Nancy ------------------------------ From: "sally.mullock" > How do vegetarians travel in England? Carefully, Nancy, very carefully No, really pretty much everywhere now has a vegetarian option, some more imaginative than others. It's just that most of us still need our meat Love SallyM - relieved Boom-Boom ain't a vedgy! ------------------------------ From: Juliann Tarsney > I use lard for piecrusts because I can't eat dairy There's always Crisco (vegetable shortening) ... used by my mother, whose piecrusts are famously delicious ... -- Juliann Tarsney ------------------------------ From: Richard Konopka > Recipes are available at . . . . Thank you for these links, Roger. They are very helpful and I just may try my hand at Clangers. I enjoyed the Bedfordshire .gov pages. Going to the travel and tourism page, I see a picture of a man who looks very much like Terry Waite in front of a stained glass window. Is it him? Richard ------------------------------ From: Roger Stokes >Thank you for these links, Roger. You're welcome >I enjoyed the Bedfordshire.gov pages. It's a delightful county, not over-visited but within easy reach of London. > Going to the travel and tourism page, I see a picture of a man who looks > very much like Terry Waite in front of a stained glass window. Is it him? It is indeed. He is standing beside a window depicting John Bunyan in his prison cell because apparently Bunyan inspired him during those years of captivity. Bunyan is a local lad, from Elstow which is on the Southern edge of town now that there has been development in that direction. It is a couple of miles from the centre and is proud of its history. There is a statue of him near the original parish church of Bedford, St Peter's - but he has turned his back on the church as you might expect ;-) A few hundred yards away, at the other end of the High Street, a statue of John Howard, the prison reformer, stands outside the newer (but still very old) parish church of St Paul's. Half way between them is the site of the old prison where Bunyan was imprisoned and where the conditions set Howard on his task of improving conditions for prisoners. That is where the bust of Trevor Huddlestone, the anti-apartheid campaigner, is to be found. He was born in a house which is now in my parish. Peace, Roger, Bedford, UK ------------------------------ From: Roger Stokes >How do vegetarians travel in England? Are they barely tolerated, in >this meat-loving culture? Nancy, To add to Sally's reply, it's a lot easier than it used to be and vegetarianism appears to be much more accepted than it used to me. Non-meat protein sources are generally available in supermarkets and, as Sally suggested, veggie options are now available in most pub-type (the most popular) food outlets and are marked as such on the menu. Some locations are still problematic with a cheese sandwich as the only option but they tend to be ones which are not part of a chain and the chef concentrates on meat and fish in his menu. If going to visit an individual it is probably best to alert the host to any food intolerances or preferences but there are a number of pub chains with very varied menus now. Peace, Roger, Bedford, UK ------------------------------ From: Roland Orr Most places ** veggie items on menus as they realize that there is a "market" Quite a few specialist shops too in most towns. Roland